to reiterate why

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guys....we`ve strayed from the real point of the matter....to get back on point,away from the name-calling and useless rhetoric and cliches...



i made the point in another thread....like israel or not,they are a democracy and our biggest ally in the region.....strangely enough,the u.s. stands by it`s allies(how very un-french of us).....

israel does have nuclear weapons....they have not used them,even though gravely provoked....

saddam hussein is on record as saying,"my biggest mistake was not having nuclear weapons when going into kuwait".....if you have a brain in your head,you understand that if the israeli`s hadn`t taken out that french built iraqi nuclear reactor in the 80`s,there would have been nuclear weapons thudding into israel,not poorly guided scuds during the gulf war.....and as i said,about 3 hiroshima-sized nuclear bombs would pretty much annihilate a small country like israel....

make no mistake....a big part of our decision to take saddam out,is rooted in the continued existence of israel....which,is seen as being jeopardized by the one dictator in the middle east crazy and ballsy enough to try and annihilate them...

the world is becoming rife with black market nuclear processing material and some say,actual nuclear weapons(the soviet union cannot account for all of their cold war weapons)....n. korea has already been caught secretly shipping missiles to terrorist nation yemen on unmarked vessels....

if saddam`s reactor hadn`t been taken out prior to the gulf war,israel would most definitely have been hit with nuclear weapons.....thus,bringing retaliatory strikes with nuclear weapons from israel....thus opening the middle east up to a full scale arab vs israeli conflict,fecking up half the world`s oil supplies,and possibly creating a global catastrophe.......

it`s not hard to understand why we are doing what we are doing...the guy has proven he`s willing to do what your average despot will not do.......

if you can`t assuredly get the knife away from jack the ripper....then you have to get rid of jack....

you may not agree....you may be jew-haters,anti-american,anti=bush administration orjust flat out anti any war....that`s your right...the france`s and germany`s are doing what they think is in their own economic and political interests and are obviously trying to bolster old european influence under the cover of the toothless u.n.....

the russia`s and china`s are voicing displeasure because they would also like to undermine american power and influence...their protests ,though,are quite muted....thankfully,they are smart enough to do it from a safe distance.....

bottom line is,the administration is choosing to stop this show before it gets to the breaking point....saddam is a monster,as are many others around the world....but he has demonstrated the instability necessary to cause a full scale middle eastern and global conflict.....

some innocents will surely die....and that`s a tragedy....but,it`s probably better to do it preemptively,before the true catastrophe takes place...



....
 
thank you judge...not sure i like this war....but,i see the logic involved....i basically wanted to get it back to issues and away from the name-calling and bomb throwing....g.l.
 
i`ll buy that....i think after the hostage crisis and khomeini,the u.s. saw iraq as the lesser of two evils....maybe not such a smart decision...point taken...
 

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This attitude that is expressed here over and over that anyone against this war habors some secret desire to undermine the states is really irritating.

If you're a conservative or Bush supporter or whatever fine, you're intitled to your opinion, but so is everybody else!

Take it at face value a lot of people in the world want peace and diplomacy at this moment and not war.

Some may hate the states, others don't. I'm very, very proud to be an American, I love my country and the principles it was founded on. Our constitution and national anthem are beautiful as well as symbols of freedom and human rights. However I am embarrassed by this war and embarrassed that once again we have a retard in the White House that perpetuates the image internationaly that we are uneducated, arrogant assholes.
 

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And I'm not embarrassed by this war and by President Bush - rather, I'm proud we took action.

Go figure.
 

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Exactly Jazz, that's the point, everyone has a right to their opinion, that's part of being a free nation.
All I'm saying is that disagreeing with this war or this president does not equate to a desire to destroy the U.S.A.
 

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I agree, kaya, and if you've read some of my postings, you'll know I've said the same thing several times.

Peace_5.gif
 

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Jazz,

Cool of you, it's frustrating that most conservatives call you anti-American or worse for not supporting their causes.
 

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Well, in all honesty, a number on the 'other side' call conservative views on the war as 'murderous', as if to imply everyone who holds a pro-war view is a rabid animal looking to butcher innocents. Wish they'd also view a reasonable, rational and thought-out conservative view the same as I do yours.
Peace_5.gif


later, time for ribs
icon_smile.gif
 
my point is that he`s doing what he thinks is in the best interests of the u.s. and it`s allies....that`s what leaders of nations do...that`s their job...to make the tough calls....not let the jacques chirac`s and the gerhard what`sis name`s shape western policy....it`a an unpopular call....that`s obvious...but so was winston churchill`s call regarding the nazi "gathering storm"...if the france`s and yes,even england had pulled their collective heads out of the sand,they may have saved millions of lives..this time we`re dealing with despots,rogue nations and ethereal terrorist groups..and weapons of mass destuction,be they chemical.biological or nuclear..........and yes,kaya,i agree with your right to dissent.....but,things are different after 3 thousand died at the world trade center....
 

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This is unreal....
and yes,kaya,i agree with your right to dissent.....but,things are different after 3 thousand died at the world trade center....

First of all that was Bin Laden, who by the way is believed to be an enemy of Saddam.

Secondly you're saying our gauranteed constitutional rights depend on the situation? That's one scary thought.
 
what guaranteed constitutional right?...to dissent?....that`s what i just said....you are dissenting,as is your right,against a government that`s very nature,it`s very meaning,it`s very being,is to guarantee your right to do so....and to try and make sure you are drawing breath so you can exercise that right.......
 

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1st Amendment
My right to speak out against this, mere dissent would be meaningless if I don't express it. Also I'm not dissenting against my government as far as the establishment. I'm dissenting against a bad administration that should even be in office considering what happened in Florida.

[This message was edited by kaya man on 03-22-03 at 07:02 PM.]
 

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No actually we are not.

You are hinting at the idea that I am against our type of government.
You also like to say dissent a lot but don't seem to realize that the words simply means to disagree. The constitutional right I mentioned was my right to express my dissent.
 
"things are different after 3 thousand died at the world trade center...."

huh? If things are indeed different then why is u.s. foreign policy identical to what it used to be: Bypassing united nations resolutions and members, bombing other nations...

I mean what the fvck had the u.s. of a. to do with yugoslavia (it'a rhetorical question) and they were bombing this country to the ground for over one and a half month? What the fvck was there, milosevich going to invade them? The official excuse by the so called liberal clinton was that they were bombing it to protect the indigenous peoples (lmao)? They were bombing it to get their people in there and their industry back to pre 19th century so the boys over at general electric etc. could clean up in terms of infrastracture big $$, and the compradore class, and the euro bussinessmen in bed with the americans...
 
no i am not.....although your last statement spoke volumes regarding your motivation...i don`t think you give a crap about this war either way.......you are still fighting the election battle...if this were a democratic administration leading this action,you`d be nowhere to be found...and that`s sad...it`s actually pathetic...i thought you actually had a legitimate point of view...you`re just playing politics.....and just for clarification,i`d gladly stand up and fight for your right to disagree,dissent,reject,oppose,be adverse to or offer arguments against(i hope that`s clear enough) this war or any other thing your little heart desires....
 
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The problem here is this: Things should NOT be different after the WTC Tragedy. The moment that we allow life to change bin Laden has succeeded. We succumb to fear.
Why? Because terrorism against the United States will always exist for as long as foreign policy does not change. If we think that war will solve this, god help us, not bless us.
 

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